Understanding Indigenous Identity and Trauma with Destiny Bailey
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (00:01.109)
Hi Destiny, thank you so much for being here!
Destiny Bailey (00:04.226)
Hi Jenna, how are you? I’m very excited to be here.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (00:07.063)
Oh, I’m so good. I’m so excited to talk to you. I know Fal and Farinacci has told us great things about Abbey House. We’re just so excited to get you on the podcast. So, I couldn’t be more grateful that you’re here today.
Destiny Bailey (00:19.246)
Thank you. I am very grateful too. This is big. This is big to be able to reach out and reach out to people so they can understand what’s really happening.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (00:32.767)
Oh, thank you. Yeah, yeah, and I know people are going to be inspired by your story. We haven’t even talked yet, but I, from what I do know, I know it’s going to be a great conversation. So, I’m really excited. So, in this series of She Is Your Neighbour, it’s all about celebrating strong Indigenous women who are moving beyond violence and helping other women move beyond violence. We’re also going to be exploring the impact that domestic violence and gender-based violence has on Indigenous communities.
Destiny Bailey (00:41.272)
Thank you.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (01:00.651)
So again, really grateful to have you here. And I was wondering if you could just start by sharing a little bit about yourself.
Destiny Bailey (01:07.052)
Okay, so I’m a 63-year-old Indigenous woman. I grew up in Winnipeg. I lived with my mom and my brother. My mom was not Indigenous. My dad was in and out of the picture. My grandmother on my dad’s side is full-blooded Blackfoot. And as a child, I remember my mom experienced a lot of domestic violence from her partner. So, I grew up very traumatized and scared.
But my mom did the best that she could being in the sixties with two Indigenous Black children. But I also remember, and this stuck with me forever because I never felt like I belonged. The lady that lived across, we lived in the developments in the north end of Winnipeg. I used to have to do chores before I could leave the house. And that was a lot of chores, washing walls, washing floors. My mom was really good learning to cook.
And so after I was done, the lady would come across the street and ask my mom if she could take me across to her place, which was just right beside it, like across the way. And she would cook me fry bread and I would sit on the stoop and she would tell me all the stories, all the history of the Indigenous people and where we’re at today. Cause in that north end, there was a lot of Indigenous people and there was a lot of drinking and fighting and…
So that was my perceptive of them until she started speaking with me and it stuck with me forever and ever. And so then I, when I was young, I, I’m like, I believe today those stories brought me where I’m at today. I also got mixed up with the wrong man and I started working the streets, moved from Winnipeg to Montreal.
And I started working the streets and then I got, I left, I left him. I moved out to Niagara Falls, St. Catharines and I got into doing drugs. So, my addiction took over and I was still working the streets. And then I stopped doing that and started selling drugs. So it took me right to a really dark place. And then after so many years of doing this, getting arrested, getting out, getting arrested, going back to doing it. I ended up doing pen time. And when I got out, I said that was it. I wasn’t doing this no more.
So I went to college at the age, I’m going to say I was 63 now, I was 48. And I went and took Child and Family Services, Native Child and Family Services, graduated from Confederation College. Obviously, I tried to find a job in Elliott Lake where I was living. And of course, I had a criminal record, so no. So, I moved back to Winnipeg where I’m from and lived with my brother. And I went on the bus. And you know, if you’ve been in Winnipeg, you know what the bus system’s like and the weather. And I went to probably 100 jobs, got interviews, got hired until they found out I had a criminal record.
So then I got a job working at Villa Rosa. And then I did cleaning and I did looking after respite, looking after children. So, I worked three jobs. And then unfortunately in 2019, I lost my mom. So, I moved back to St. Catharines, because I still kept in touch with a few people that had got their life together.
And I started working at DLB Electric, which I was the worst administrative assistant you can think of, but it was a really good friend of mine and then COVID hit. So I started cleaning houses, driving for pie guys and working at a restaurant on the weekend. And then I applied to the Niagara Regional Native Center. And this is where I’m at today. So it was a long haul, but I guess perseverance paid off and,
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (05:05.175)
Ya
Destiny Bailey (05:29.122)
Yeah, I’ll be here five years in October.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (05:32.153)
That’s amazing Destiny. I’m so glad. What a journey you’ve had and thank you for sharing that with us. I know that’s just a short summary and scratching the surface, but it’s nice to kind of understand the full picture. So, thank you so much for sharing that with us.
Destiny Bailey (05:45.998)
You’re welcome.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (05:50.163)
And that’s amazing where you are now too. There’s a few things that you shared in there that I kind of wanted to ask you a little bit more about if that’s okay. The one thing that first stuck out to me is you talked about the woman who lived across the way and how she really changed, you know, your perception of Indigenous people. And I thought that was so cool because I think there are so many stereotypes out there.
Destiny Bailey (05:56.76)
Sure. Yeah. Yes.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (06:14.304)
and they’re not always accurate, you know? So it’s so nice to hear that she was able to change your perspective. Could you share a little bit more about that, if you’re willing?
Destiny Bailey (06:23.852)
Okay, well, she, okay, so we would sit and she would, I would say to her like, why are they always fighting with each other? But then my mom was, you know, a part of that domestic violence too. But I said, why are they always fighting? Why are they drinking? Why are they doing this? And she would explain to me that the trauma, this was never like this. They were never like this. The women would look after the children and the cooking and the men would go out and hunt and they would only take what they needed.
And it was the hap, they were happy. Like they were a family. And I mean, it didn’t matter if you weren’t related, aunties, uncles, they were, you know what I mean? Taking care of each other. And she said, and then the colonization happened. And then the 60 scoop where they stole the children. So, parents didn’t get to parent their children. And then those children growing up did not know how to parent their children. So it was just a whole cycle over and over again, and it helped me to understand. And I think once I realized that I didn’t belong and then I went through my addiction, I really, really got into doing my studies and reading and it was amazing. How they used to use moths for diapers, how they only killed the animals that they needed to feed their families.
You know, it really made me look differently about the trauma that the Indigenous people are going through, especially the women and the girls. The women and the girls, just, it’s a target on their back. And it’s just like, well, it’s just another Indian. No, it’s a human being. They have parents, people that care about them. They’re still human beings. So yeah.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (08:12.907)
Yeah. thank you for sharing that. I think that’s just so important to understand. And we can’t talk about Indigenous history and the culture without talking about colonization and the 60s scoop and the impact that this had on all these people and the intergenerational trauma that Indigenous people have had to endure. I think it’s just completely unfair. And I think once you unpack some of that, it’s so much easier to have empathy and understand these experiences, right? So, I’m so glad you shared that, I think that’s a really important thing to highlight here and something I want our listeners to get out of this too, to really try and take away some of those stereotypes that I think still exist.
Destiny Bailey (08:53.678)
And for people to say, just get over it, you’ve got to meet people where they’re at. And I mean, and that was a learning curve for me here when I started at Abbey House was, okay, just because you did it, but I had to unpack trauma too. I put myself through a lot of abuse. I put myself through situations that should have never done that, but I’m still alive because you can’t come back from dead. You can come back from mostly anything, but you can’t come back from dead.
So, I believe the creator has me here to be able to help and guide these women and children to have a better life, happy, healthy life, to have a roof over their head and not to be judged or stereotyped.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (09:36.993)
I think so too. And I think just your journey is incredible and it’s kind of come full circle and here you are now working with Indigenous women and kids. And I just think that’s so amazing and going back to school at 48, like it’s just, it’s incredible what you’ve been able to accomplish despite all the hurdles that you faced. So, I love hearing about that. I’m also wondering if you could share a little bit about some of your personal experience, a bit more of your personal experience with domestic violence.
Destiny Bailey (09:42.872)
Yeah. Yeah.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (10:05.239)
And I believe you experienced some human trafficking as well.
Destiny Bailey (10:09.24)
Yeah, the first gentleman that I got involved with snatched me. I mean, I wasn’t young. I was 25, but I think I was still naive. Do know what I mean? Like I was one of those girls that, you you get married, you have a white picket fence, have two children, and you stay married for the rest of life was my goal in life. And that didn’t work out.
So we went, like I said, took me to Montreal and Calgary, Alberta, and he had a couple of other women. I was out there making thousands of dollars a day. I wasn’t into the drugs at this, at this time, but you know, the high life, was great. You know, you’re wearing all these fancy clothes and blah, blah, blah. And, then the violence started.
He wasn’t as violent, but the violence started and the neglect. And so I left and I started hanging out with the girls that were with, not with pimps and we started using drugs and it started off just, you know, once in a while on the weekends and then it got carried away. And then I met another guy who was very violent, who, I, black eyes, black eyes, fat lips, get out there and get to work and, you know, come take your money sort of thing.
So, then I left there and I, came out to St. Catharines, Niagara Falls and I was with a white guy who was a drug dealer and very, very abusive. he would go out and sleep with other women then come home and beat me up, put my head through a glass door, choked me with a rope, ripped up my clothes, and then send me out to work to make money because he didn’t have any money. Yeah. And then I started trying to make contact with my child because I did get married, had a child, and he was very abusive. And so I left. I left with my mother-in-law and was trying to go back and see her, but every time I go, he’d beat me up. So, I get my mother-in-law to bring her over to see me. And then I just got involved with this guy. And every time I was time to see my daughter, he would punch me in the face so I’d have a black eye so I couldn’t see her. That lasted for five years. I kept leaving. He kept finding me and dragging me back.
And then until finally he threw a spoon, hit me in the back of my head and split my head open. And I took off and I was walking down the stairs and this police officer, of course I knew a lot of the police officers because they used to tell me, you know, this is not for you. And I was like, yeah, I know eventually I’m going to come out of it. And they said, unless you die. And I was, I didn’t know it was bleeding. And he pulled me over and said, you’re bleeding.
And I told him what happened. So, he went back to the house and knocked on the door and took off his police belt and told him to come outside and said, let’s see how you feel. I was like, no, leave it alone. Cause he eventually he will find me. I left Niagara Falls, went to St. Catharines and then, I left him and then I continued and continued to, sell drugs. And that was my thing, selling drugs.
Not to pregnant women, not to people under age, but I was the worst drug dealer because it was like giving it away, making sure the girls that are working on the streets had a place to stay, gave them clothes, but it still didn’t make up for what I did. So, you know, there was a lot of guilt there. and then I got arrested and did pen time. And I think that was the wake up call. It was like, you know, and I think I just, cause I walked down the street one day and I said, you know what, creator?
I’m going to die or I’m going to go to jail for a long time. And I guess he chose the latter. And yeah, so I’ve been clean since, it’s almost 18 years in October, or September, sorry, 18 years in September.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (14:37.355)
Wow, that’s amazing. That’s such an accomplishment. Congratulations on that too. And Destiny, just, really appreciate you sharing your short story. I know it’s probably still hard to retell. It’s hard to listen to, to be honest. It’s awful what you had to endure. I can’t believe how you’ve just come out of this and turned your life around. It’s really incredible and inspiring.
Destiny Bailey (14:38.924)
Yeah. Thank you.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (15:04.147)
Also, something that I kind of noticed when you sharing your story was about the violence, how it kind of escalated over time for you too, you know? And that’s something I want to point out because sometimes people ask, you know, why did she get in a relationship with this guy? Or why didn’t she just leave? And it’s not as simple as that, right? And I think your story helps highlight that, that, you know, it starts with the really small things and then you start to not realize and then the next thing happens and the next thing happens and before you know it things have gotten out of control a lot of the time.
Destiny Bailey (15:36.3)
You know, the thing is, I don’t have family in St. Catharines. I have friends. I didn’t grow up with people here. I grew up in Winnipeg. So the last guy that I was with, I think the breaking point was when he bought me a car and I kept it. And then he sucked me in. So, here’s me sleeping on different people’s couches, getting hotel rooms, and I just kind of wanted a home. So, I went back, went for a ride.
He took me out to the golf course, beat me so bad, left me unconscious. I couldn’t see out of either my eyes. And I somehow made it across the street to Four Corners to the phone booth and phoned a friend who had called me a taxi. As I’m on the phone, he came rushing over in the car and tried to run me over in the phone booth. The cab ended up, and I think that was the last draw for me, but it was always wanting to be accepted from people that I only met in this kind of lifestyle that I was leading, you know? So, yeah.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (16:44.672)
Yeah, well and the isolation, that’s what I hear too. You, you said you didn’t have the family that you had back home, so you were isolated. You didn’t have anyone else you could rely on or lean on. And we know that violence is likely to escalate when someone is isolated because the abusive person can use that to their advantage too. And it sounds like that’s what happened here in some ways.
Destiny Bailey (17:07.682)
Yeah. Yeah, it was. I mean, we had a nice home. We had dogs. We had a nice home. He was just a very violent gentleman. yeah. Yeah. It’s crazy. It’s crazy.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (17:19.221)
Yeah, yeah and so you mentioned then you ended up going to prison for a little bit. I wondered if you could share a little bit about that experience and if it’s relevant how addiction impacted your journey as well.
Destiny Bailey (17:34.126)
Okay. So I was constantly in and out of jail either for prostitution, not so much the drugs. I was pretty, pretty slick, but eventually that, that landed me in the big house, and driving under suspension. I mean, I just never renewed my license. So, driving under suspension. So that landed me in and out. I, I’d only go for like, they’d say 30 days. So you do 20 and then it got to five months.
And I did three and then it got to seven months and then I did five. And I just said I had a obsession. So last time I went to court, I said I obsession with driving, which I believe I did because I have a very addictive personality. So he said, next time you come back, you’re going to be doing a year. So that for a couple of years, was not, I was still using and selling, but I was just staying out of the limelight. And when you go to jail,
I didn’t know anything. I was naive. I knew how to sell drugs. I knew how to sell myself. But you learn how to do frauds. You learn how to cook drugs. You learn how to do everything that these groups, because that’s all they do. All we had to do is sit around and talk about crimes. So when you leave there, you have a wealth of crime that you can do. Not that I did it because, you know, that was enough for me, but…
That was the extent of everything that the jail had to offer. I mean, there was programming when you got to the pen, but other than that, you just sit around, eat and talk and they smoke weed, smoke hash and do their drugs, make brew, learn how to make brew in the toilet. You know what I mean? It’s, yeah. And you know, it’s so, I think to me going to jail, if I was that, brave, I would have learned to do a lot more crimes, which you used to see the girls, it was like a revolving door. And last time I couldn’t wait. And I said, that would be my last time. And it’s my last time. It was my last time, but it’s scary. There’s lots of violence. There’s lots of people that are getting packages in jail. And so there’s no rehabilitation, you know, they just, they really need to put some programming and like with here, with Abbey House, we’re teaching them how to open a bank account, how to budget money, how to cook, how to clean. Do you know what mean? You don’t learn any of that. So, yeah.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (20:09.695)
Yeah, yeah, I can’t believe that. That’s crazy how you can learn so much more about crime and it can just kind of snowball as you’re in there. When you said, you know, the last time was your last time in there. Was there something different about that time or was it just a switch in your mind? Like, do you know what it was that made it the last time?
Destiny Bailey (20:31.352)
Yeah, it was going to the big house. It was going to the penitentiary. Thank goodness it wasn’t P4W because P4W, I had a few people that I associated with that didn’t make it out of there because they hung them, they got killed, they got shanked. It was Grand Valley Institution, which soon as I got in, because I had my grade 12, I started doing horticulture. In the day, I did maintenance and in the afternoon, I did horticulture.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (20:35.542)
Okay.
Destiny Bailey (21:01.534)
And one of the girls was getting packages, got high, hit a guard’s car. So, they asked me if I want to go off because I have no violence on my record. None at all. No sex, no pedophile, no sexuality, no sexual assault, none of that. And they asked me if I wanted to go on the outside and cut the grass, which was great because I wanted to get away from people and their stories. I just wanted to live a normal life, connect with my daughter and reconnect with my family. So she told me that I was gonna pick up packages for her I said, no, I’m not. And she said, then you’re gonna meet me in the gym at seven o’clock and we’re gonna fight. And I’m like, okay. I said, I guess I’m gonna get beat up. So I went back to my house and I had a really good house. We had a baby in the house at the time. And so I had the girls braid my hair.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (21:49.809)
My gosh.
Destiny Bailey (21:58.926)
Put Vaseline all over my face and I walked away crying going, okay, I’m getting another beating. And then my whole house followed me and told her, if you fight her, you got to fight all of us. So that was, yeah, that was, but she was violent. I watched her smash a girl’s face open right across her forehead. We had CIA Kingston in there. Yeah, there’s a lot of violence going on there. And I just really wanted to get out because I really wanted to live.
I think I didn’t want to die yet. hadn’t, I missed my twenties and my thirties and some of my forties and I just needed to, catch up to being my age and I dismissed everything. So I think that’s what, yeah. And then, you know, you have a, a record, it’s really hard to get a job. It’s really hard to get across the border. I mean, even though it’s a long time, I’m still fighting…
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (22:41.557)
Yeah. Oh
Destiny Bailey (22:56.962)
to get back over there to see, because my grandkids are there.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (23:00.681)
Okay, my gosh. Well, I’m glad you had that community that you lived with too, who stood behind you. Cause I was getting scared for the end of that story there. And I’m happy that, that didn’t go the way it did. And then how you were able to kind of change things and use it as a wake up call. I think it’s incredible. Like you just have so much resilience and strength in you to be able to do that after all you’ve been through.
Destiny Bailey (23:07.416)
Yeah. Yeah, I am very determined. mean, even once I was out and things weren’t always, I still was a people pleaser and that was, think, I wasn’t who I was. So now I’m 63, now I’m 63. Do know what I mean? I’ve grown into who I should be. I’m a lot more confident in myself. I mean, we still, you know,
These women, have their breakdowns. I have my breakdowns, but they all know everything comes from love and kindness. And just to remember, this is where they’re at, destiny, and they eventually will get there. We have an 85 % success rate, so I’m pretty happy.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (24:08.223)
Yes, please, please tell us a bit more about Abbey House. That’s something we haven’t really gotten into yet. So what is that Abbey House? Tell us all about it.
Destiny Bailey (24:14.222)
Okay. Okay, I can talk about, I’m going to talk about Maxine Abbey for a second. She’s the one, okay, she was the founding members of the Niagara Regional Native Centre. She sat on the board of directors for several years and has contributed greatly to our region. So, during her time on the board, she had a vision of a transitional support home for women and children.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (24:19.541)
Sure.
Destiny Bailey (24:41.998)
Unfortunately, in 2004, she was hospitalized and later passed away. However, the transitional house was created. in 2007, in March 2007, Abbey House opened up. Her daughter, Roxanne Abbey, it was the president of the board. She’s now the vice president of the board, but she was an active, Maxine was an active within the community at event. She’d be the first one there, the last one to leave. So, we have her picture all through Abbey House. She’s shining down on us.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (25:07.068)
Well.
Destiny Bailey (25:09.902)
And she was known as a greeter, respected by her community and her own personal crisis and personal chaos made her stronger and gave strength to the Aboriginal women who were engulfed in their own crisis. So her mission was to survive Main Strong and she’s very much missed and remembered. And so the mission, she wanted to have a mission. So the purpose of Abbey House is to provide a safe opportunity for transitional living. It’s not a shelter.
It’s transitional living for Indigenous women with or without children who are at risk of homelessness and are in a transitional period in their life. So, Abbey House will support the women on an outreach basis also. So, it’s we create nurturing, stable, culturally based living environment that encourages, empowers individuals to make positive, long-lasting changes in their lives, in their life, sorry. Abbey House will support women and their children to overcome homelessness.
societal barriers by assisting them to achieve emotional, spiritual, mental, and physical well-being. So that’s our mission. So, we have four bedrooms. We have two large family room, which is split into two rooms. And we have a smaller family room and two single rooms. So, Abbey House, they had, before I started, and I’m going to do a little bragging because
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (26:15.915)
That’s incredible.
Destiny Bailey (26:36.01)
Abbey House has been open 15 years last September and the last four years, Abbey House is top notch. Our funders are so impressed with how Abbey House is being run. Mind you, they come in, we do an interview. And what we started, what I started doing was I was having them do eight workshops a month to get to know each other, because we were closed during COVID, right?
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (26:51.22)
Yeah
Destiny Bailey (27:05.58)
So we did a lot of outreach and then we started bringing people in the house, but we did them, we did workshops with them so we can get to know them and see how people, if you’re going through trauma and you’re going through a lot of inner turmoil, you don’t need to be in a room with somebody because they were fitting eight to 10 people in this house. And I was like, how, how is that person going to heal? Right? You can’t. So.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (27:33.237)
Mm-hmm.
Destiny Bailey (27:35.892)
One person per room, a family, you know, a smaller family and then two single. So they come in, we do workshops, we do a lot of workshops. I do fun things. take them to that big park in Toronto with all the rides. Canada’s Wonderland, we do massages. We’re taking them on a retreat either to…
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (27:56.4)
Canada’s Wonderland? Aww.
Destiny Bailey (28:05.208)
Great Wolf Lodge or to the spa place. I can’t remember the name of it. I really want to go take them out to Whitby where there is that thermal spa. So yeah, so we’re going to do that. But they either have to work or go to school. they, sure. So we have a chore list. We put a chore list up. And if they don’t know how, hey, I love a clean place, especially when there’s children. So…
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (28:17.085)
Yes, yes, my gosh.
Destiny Bailey (28:33.58)
Let’s do this. We’ll sit down all together and just start scrubbing and cleaning. So the girl I was working with left, I was by myself for two and a half years with 10 outreach families, no, 13 outreach families and probably 15 to 20 children, four in-house women with 10 children. And I did it by myself for two and a half years. And this…
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (28:59.691)
How? My gosh.
Destiny Bailey (29:01.49)
And this, I had three jobs, so I had to quit the other two. But this, and I didn’t do banked hours. This is my passion. It’s not my job. It’s my passion. And there was a lot of trauma going on in the house, but I’m telling you right now, this is my fifth group. The last four groups, success stories, those groups, and they still call me and still talk to me. I still see their children at events and they still remember. And the tears, the sweat, the long hours, all paid off.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (29:31.041)
That is so amazing. Just hear you talk about it. It’s just you’re glowing like it radiates off you. You could tell it’s your passion and that you really are meant to do this destiny, you know, and it makes it seem to me almost like these things that you went through as awful as they were it. It almost in a way, I don’t want to say needed to happen, but if it didn’t happen, you wouldn’t be able to help these women in this way. And it’s incredible.
Destiny Bailey (29:31.113)
I mean… No, no. And I tell them I’m not ashamed. I tell them my story and I sit down and I say, it’s not about me, it’s about you. Let’s figure out. Maybe it’s not going to happen today, but if you’re putting in the work, I guarantee you 99.9%, it’ll work out. We will keep working on this. I’m like a dog with a bone. I’m not letting it go. And yeah, they’re living in their own places. They have their children. Some of them have jobs.
Some of them are in, they went to Empower to do upgrading and now they’re in college, which either Appetiswin pays for their schooling and gives them a living allowance of $2,000 a month. They go to Homeward Bound, which is the same thing. It’s a four-year program where they can go to school for four years. I have very good connections with landlords where they don’t have to do credit checks and they get housed. We help them with their first month’s rent.
You know, we do grocery cards. Abbey House buys the groceries. We don’t buy steak and lobster or pop and chips, but you know what I mean? If you don’t know how to cook, we have cooking classes, um, beading classes. I’m still five years in and still don’t know how to be, but nope. Nope. started and I’m like, I’m done. Yeah. Yeah. I can’t do it.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (31:07.703)
You’re learning! That is okay, my gosh. With all the other amazing programs you have for them, I don’t think they mind if you can’t feed.
Destiny Bailey (31:23.136)
Yeah, yeah, yeah, they laugh at me, they laugh. But we’ve had a lot of tears and a lot of crying and a lot of arguments, but you know what? They know it’s all coming from love and it just works out. say, listen, my life didn’t change overnight. It had to change within first in order for me to be able to do this in a healthy, happy way, like out of love. And I mean…
I know I probably shouldn’t say this, but yes, I answer my phone on the weekends. Yes, I answer my phone after hours. If it’s an emergency, I’m trying, but you know what? When you’re so passionate about something and you see that success and everything they’ve gone through, it’s so amazing. It’s so amazing. Like these women…
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (32:05.769)
Yeah. Well, it doesn’t sound like a job. sounds like a part of who you are at this point, right? It’s a part of your identity.
Destiny Bailey (32:11.758)
Yeah, it is, it’s amazing. I just wish you could come and see the work that gets done here.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (32:20.201)
I want to sometime. I would love that.
Destiny Bailey (32:40.11)
And I mean, we’re, yeah, yeah, yeah, we’re a big part of the center. We have also a justice department, you know, if anything, they can’t come here with a criminal proceedings. I mean, criminal record, yes, but not still going to court. They have to be clean, 90 days.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (32:44.072)
Mm, yes.
Destiny Bailey (32:47.11)
I will work with outreach if they’ve been clean for 30 days and we can send them up north, up to Manitoulin Island for three months on the land. We do counseling with, I don’t want to trash their name, but it’s N-O-O-J-I-M-O. We do counseling with them and it’s an Indigenous health and wellness. We have an elder, Roger, who does sweats with us.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (32:46.262)
Mm-hmm.
Destiny Bailey (33:06.772)
It’s there’s so much, I’ve learned so much about my Indigeneity since I’ve been here and I’m just embracing it. Like I was robbed, you know, so I understand how they feel. Do you know what I mean? The way that indigenous people, the kindness that they show, the way they treat their children, the way they talk to their children, not just throw them in front of the TV. And we have a TV, we have Netflix.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (33:15.903)
Yes.Yes.
Destiny Bailey (33:34.572)
We play outside in the backyard. have a sauna back there. We have a playground for the children. We do gardening in the summertime. All these life skills that they need when they leave here. You know, you get pushback, but you’re just like, okay, well, let’s do something else then. Maybe you want to cook lunch with me. You know, you just have to look at where they’re at right now.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (33:58.625)
Well, and it’s amazing too. sounds to me that part of your, tell me if I’m wrong, but what I’m hearing is part of your healing journey has been connecting to your indigenous roots too. And that’s so amazing. Like I love that. I feel like it’s come full circle from you sitting there talking to the woman across the way. And now you’re learning back to your roots, learning all these things. And it’s just so amazing and inspiring to hear about.
Destiny Bailey (34:08.43)
100%. 100%. And the center, the center, was a lot of good mentors there for me that didn’t judge me, didn’t laugh at me, were willing to teach me, to willing to show me the way of the Indigenous people. And yeah, it’s amazing. My grandkids, because I used to be very angry, my grandkids just think Nana’s… peaches and cream right now. They’re like, wow, Nana, you’re so cool. Yeah, but you learn a lot.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (34:54.374)
Aw. Aw. Well, why wouldn’t they? There’s a… Yeah, I’m sure. And there’s something cool you said in there talking about the women, how they have to do chores and you’re happy to teach them. And it made me think about your mom, because I think you said your mom really instilled the chores in you. And I also remember you said earlier that she passed away. You lost her in 2019. And I just wondered, is it…Is that a way you can bring her with you or is there anything you wanted to share about that?
Destiny Bailey (35:26.67)
I miss her, I miss her every day. I try not to dwell on the many nights that she didn’t sleep and the many nights that she didn’t know where I was because we did have a good relationship once I went to the pen. She was my biggest supporter. Her and I have good friend Steve of mine were my biggest supporters. I did never get a chance to…
get to see her before she passed. But, you know, she did come, actually she did come a couple of times to Winnipeg. She came out to Elliott Lake to see me, but, there’s so much that’s happened in my life that I’m so proud of that. I know she’s watching, but yeah, I miss that. So I always try like you only get one mom, my dad, not so much cause he wasn’t there. you know what I mean? I still miss him. He’s still my dad, but my mom was my rock.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (36:25.013)
Yeah.
Destiny Bailey (36:25.09)
So actually she lives in my heart every day. I have her ashes at my house and I’m refusing to give them up. My brother and I are having heavy discussions about that, but I just feel very close to her being there. Yeah. Yeah. I’m sorry.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (36:38.615)
Yeah, I love that so much. My dad passed away two years ago. Thank you. So I know how it feels to lose a parent, but I know when you find ways to be able to carry them with you, it just really changes how you’re able to move forward. I just, when I thought of you doing the chores, it made me think of her and how she was there with you. I love it so much. Yes. Yes, exactly. Oh, that’s amazing.
Destiny Bailey (36:59.222)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She was like, get those girls cleaning. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She is. And I know, I know, I know she’s an angel up there with my aunt who was also my biggest supporter. so I mean, you know, I do have a breakdown once in a while, but you know what? It’s just like, Hey, I know you’re watching. I know you’re watching and you’re guiding me because life, actually my life, you know, they say things happened in threes and then it’s like, okay. That was supposed to happen to learn us some kind of lesson. I did. Okay, let’s move forward.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (37:34.291)
Yes, and she is watching, know it. And I know she’d be so proud and she’d be happy seeing those women doing the cleaning. you know, I know she would be. Before we go here, Destiny, I wanted to ask you something we always ask every guest on the podcast is about how we can be better neighbors. This is called She Is Your Neighbor. We really try and highlight how domestic violence and gender-based violence happens in all neighborhoods. It impacts people of all different backgrounds. And I wondered if you could share how you think we could all be better neighbors to Indigenous women and girls who are experiencing gender-based violence.
Destiny Bailey (38:13.144)
Okay, well, you know what? This podcast was very important to me. As an Indigenous woman, I want to see change. I know Abbey House is a small piece of the puzzle, and I keep hearing how changes are being made. Maybe not fast enough for me, but I think a little at a time, and it’s not enough. I feel that they already know what’s happening, so there is need to help our Indigenous communities. They went through a lot.
You know, this was their land, so they went through a lot. So, Abbey House is going to keep moving forward and try and reach and help and support as many people as we can. And as a community, we need to be kinder, more open-minded, supportive, and meet people where they’re at. Have listening ears. And sometimes that’s all people need is to hear, to know someone’s listening to them, to hear what they have to say. And then maybe sit down and brainstorm.
But show compassion, show you care. If you can help in any kind of way, you can help. It doesn’t have to be money-wise. It could be helped by listening. It can be helped by giving out resources. It can be helped by giving them some kind of information that will help them to either find a place, find a food bank. Do you know what I mean? It’s just, we need to be a lot kinder and not so judgy of people because everybody’s struggling right now.
And it’s unfortunate because addiction now has gotten way, way out of line. It’s people are dying and like, you can’t come back from dying, but you just still don’t sit there and judge that person. You know, when we have drum nights, we take the extra food to a shelter and we feed them. Do you know what I mean? And I think my grandkids on the weekends, when I have them and Nana makes too much food, we go out and we feed them.
Because I think my grandkids are too bougie, okay? And I said, this can happen overnight. These people didn’t ask for this to happen. So I think as a community, we need to be a little bit more understanding. We need to have some more treatment centers. We need to have some better health and wellness. And we need to get back to the land. You know what I mean? And listen to people and talk to people and find out what we can do to help them.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (40:10.625)
Yeah.
Destiny Bailey (40:35.53)
It might not work today, it might not work tomorrow, but eventually you plant that seed, it’s gonna work.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (40:41.219)
I agree. And I think that, you know, you highlighted how listening is just so important. And I think it sounds like that’s something you’re able to do at Abbey House. Being a survivor yourself, I think you listen with a different ear and they can relate to you in a different way. And I think even Abbey House listening to you in this role, you you’re able to bring your expertise as a survivor to say, these rooms are not set up right. This is not helping healing. Like even to me, that’s such a great example of…
Destiny Bailey (40:42.338)
Yeah. Mmmm
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (41:09.643)
You know, we need to listen to survivors and hear their input and bring them into the change that needs to happen. So thank you so much, Destiny, for being here today. I’m so grateful to talk with you.
Destiny Bailey (41:17.678)
Thank you. this was amazing. Thank you for making me comfortable and letting me hopefully reach a few people after this podcast.
Jenna Mayne (she/her) (41:25.002)
Ugh. I know this is going to inspire so many people. Thank you, Destiny.
Destiny Bailey (41:32.76)
Thank you so much.
